Hello everyone!
I want to share the following situation. My friend from the UK sent me letters. Letters now go much longer than before the start of current events. When the first letter arrived, I was surprised to see that it was torn on one side. And I think it was a cut. There are no stamps or other marks that there was censorship. A second letter has just arrived. There are holes on both sides. In both cases, all the contents came completely, but the holes, in my opinion, cannot be an accident. In all the past years, I have never received such letters. Although I have repeatedly had metal objects in my letters - ships, piers, cranes, buildings at a scale of 1:1200 (I have a collection of a miniature military harbor), there have never been any holes or damage to the envelopes. Has anyone ever met this? How would you explain it?
Hi Sozont
I cannot be certain - you could be right that there may be some censorship going on somewhere (UK or Russia ???). However, there could be a more simple explanation - the two letters have become damaged in the post (possibly due to the mechanisation processes used here in UK). I do sometimes get mail sent to me from elsewhere in UK but with one side completely open (thankfully nothing had dropped out) - a most recent example was the ABPS News magazine sent to me (one copy only). Certainly your second photo looks as though the side of the envelope has been damaged, rather than deliberately opened. If opened for censorship I would have thought whoever was doing it would want to open it up completely to examine the contents (i.e. read the letter). Whilst I cannot comment on the airletter the other letter looks as though it had content which may have assisted in it becoming torn (as opposed to being deliberately cut).
Hope this helps!
Regards, Mike
Mike, hi!
Thank you for your opinion!
I would like to believe that these are coincidences.
Perhaps the goal is not to read (for this it was necessary to tear it to the end), but to check what exactly is contained in the envelope. For example, is there any currency or something else prohibited there.
Just received a third letter from the UK. Same. This cannot be an accident. And the hole looks too unnatural.
[img]https://sun9-55.userapi.com/impg/BzZ9pTZ76LSyBIRu5elSyx4WyXgRKtekj7QZlA/D54xFRr5JAA.jpg?size=1006x881&quality=96&sign=a1cb543d0742d0b96c9b51cac758150b&type=album[/img]
Hi Sozent
Three possibilities here spring to mind.
1. Coincidence that the mail handling equipment is damaging the mails when handled. Is any internal mail turning up the such?
2. You have a'light fingered' local postman in the system looking for currency or valuables in mails from abroad.
3. 'The state' has instigated the opening and possible monitoring of mails from abroad. Censorship and 'we as a state don't care that its clear your mail has been tampered with.'
Take your pick, I'd certainly favour 2 or more likely 3.
Take Care. Chris
Hello Sozont
I tend to agree with you, I think the opening of these envelopes is intentional. They have been neatly slit open on one side in each case. If this had been done in the UK I would have expected some kind of resealing label to have been applied when this was done, or subsequently noticed.
The contents seem to have included items other than a letter, i.e. slightly bulky, which would have aroused interest/suspicion. Currently Royal Mail are refusing mail which has stamps inside (presumably current, mint), for mail to Russia if you try to send it 'signed for/registered. These envelopes were not registered and posted into post boxes to test the system. The envelopes also had two or three attractive GB commemoratives affixed, something of a temptation in the past, but survived the journey.
Mike - are you suggesting the machine damage was due to this mail (to Russia) being machine treated differently to say a similar envelope sent elsewhere? I've sent many A5 envelopes with contents which have never received this treatment.
The envelopes attached by Sozont show some postal markings - are they the UK cancellations only?
I'm sure there must be other members mailing to Russia. A friend on Teesside had his mail to Russia refused at the post office because it contained stamps.
Just seen Chris's post. I would eliminate 1 and 2.
1. Too much of a coincidence
2 If a dishonest postman looked inside, surely he would have destroyed the item rather than leave the evidence to be discovered
3 The most likely reason
Cheers
Tony
Hi Tony
I made the point that recently I received the latest edition of ABPS News (1 copy only) and one side was completly split open (how I don't know). In another example, another society I work for received an A5 size type padded envelope at its address and again the side was completly torn open, again thankfully nothing was missing (4 very thin A5 booklets). I can only assume that these damages are due to the automated sorting machines.
Mike
Chaps, conspiracy theories are all very well, but I have to bring to your attention some evidence which supports Mike's hypothesis that it's Royal Mail's machinery that is vandalising at least some of the mail. I attach (I hope) a photo of the envelope in which I received the latest SPH Journal the other day. The picture shows the envelope in 'as received' condition. As you can see, Royal Mail had very kindly saved me the effort of opening the envelope. The Journal, surprisingly enough, was still present, thankfully.
It seems to me therefore that, as usual, it's more likely to be a good old-fashioned cock up on somebody's part (maladjusted machinery), than a huge concerted effort by some malignant entity to screw over a third party. :-)
rgds
N
Chris, Tony, Mike, Nick hello!
Thanks for your opinions!
There are no additional marks on the letters.
There is no Russian cancellation. There is only a round seal of Vnukovo airport and the seal of my post office.
I have never received such letters, not in domestic or international mail.
There was only one case (a year ago or maybe more) when I received an international small parcel in a cardboard box. It was torn in one of the places. This place was sealed with tape with the logo of the Russian Post. I received the parcel at the post office and there I had to sign on a special form that I was familiar with the information that the damage occurred during the postal shipment.
Prior to these events, I asked the oldest postal clerk in our post office if he was interested in philately. He said he wasn't and he didn't know anyone who was interested. So it is unlikely that any of the postmen would be interested in the stamps on the letter (although they are really very good) or in its content.
Letters arrive in the mailbox. If it were another time now, I would go to the post office and try to find out. But at the moment, for obvious reasons, I would not like to draw additional attention to myself.
I would really like it to be the first option (as Mike and Nick hints at). Although there is a desire to choose point 3.
Let's see what will happen next.
Hi, Sozont,
Yes, we need more observations, don't we? We have only five examples, I think, three of yours, one of Mikes, and one of mine, all posted within the UK, and all 'damaged' - for want of a better description - at one edge. Is that a good summary of the data set?
A question for you: have you received any mail from elsewhere in the world that bears similar damage?
rgds
N
Prior to the well-known events, I receivedinternational mail (primarily from UK, the USA and Germany). As I said, there was never any damage (the only time I described in the last letter and it was not an envelope, but a box). But after February I received only 3 letters from Britain and all of them were damaged. Of course, this is still not enough to draw conclusions.
In the absence of any other 'evidence', our Royal Mail handling mechanism seems to be the culprit.
Normally RM indicate one way or another that a package has been damaged, and repaired. I've had empty envelopes delivered. apologising for the contents being missing. With an envelope having one side completely slit open, the contents are at considerable risk of being lost, especially during such a long journey.
One must assume therefore if RM are responsible, no one noticed the damage. One way to try and identify where it happened would be to send a similar packet insured for a large amount - that should make them pay attention. From the Forum posts it seems it is only A5 size envelopes which are subject to the damage? Has anyone had similar problems with a 1/3rd A4 envelope?
Cheers
Tony
Hello to all!
I received two letters from Britain and again the same thing. In the end, I decided to do an experiment. I asked a friend from Holland to send me a letter. Let's see if it comes whole or not. If integer, then it will be possible to consider that this is a British machine error. If it is opened, then it will be possible to suspect censorship.
[img]https://sun9-47.userapi.com/impg/9ts8DOyopT-UCWAMfOCTa-sNJUe6PpJh-SAKvQ/1sZptGYPnhY.jpg?size=720x684&quality=96&sign=8f67e6da0e76246facae2a6e1829e34b&type=album[/img]
[img]https://sun9-11.userapi.com/impg/NzChaVfihMLr4YPTqrHR_U4atED-AQp2j7EMWg/7DBHAsifyOg.jpg?size=610x761&quality=96&sign=5f7e537b26823f0d4b213f3a14517b11&type=album[/img]
Good call, Sozont. The result of your experiment will be either most interesting, or quite disappointing! :-)
rgds
N
I do not see this being a Royal Mail machine error.
I mail A5 envelopes around the world most days of the week and never has anyone come back and said the envelope was damaged or opened (the occasional item goes missing).
I would suggest another cause of damage, or opening.
Peter
I agree with Peter. I do not think this is a machine malfunction here in the UK as I mentioned in an earlier post. We'll see. There are no reports of standard (A6) envelopes being slit open, perhaps Sozont has not received any such envelopes?
The interesting thing is that the mail seems to be getting through, at least from the UK to Russia. How about in the opposite direction?
Tony
Yes, I agree with Peter, I don't think it is a 'constant flaw' as they say in philately, laid at the door of RM. If it was it would have been corrected by now.
As Nick says, it will be interesting to hear from the various 'test' postings now in progress
Cheers
Tony
Hello everyone!
In continuation of the topic.
Just received 2 letters. One from my friend from England. it was opened, like all the previous ones, but sealed with a special Russian mail tape. Another from Holland. it was not opened. And therefore I think that, probably, openings take place in England. Now I am sending a letter to England. Let's see how it will come.
[img]https://sun9-29.userapi.com/impg/kOHLtOHaZlsirs1o75D1DRkwzM1Xdo9xAo03lw/3pAw76-QEYE.jpg?size=1620x2160&quality=96&sign=75fd130437ea83717f7fcee62c18094e&type=album[/img]
Hello Sozent
Unlikely I'd think the the British PO would use a Russian language sealing tape or label.
My 'gut' feeling is this is taking place once arrival in Russia. With the current 'climate' mail from the UK may be subject to special treatment.
Time for that one way ticket to Helsinki or Berlin?
Cheer, Stay safe. Chris
Chris, hello!
No, I mean, I think that it could have been opened in the UK (including accidentally mechanically, as already suggested by one of the commenters on this topic), and then sealed in Russia. After all, the letter from Holland came intact .. If there were censorship, then it would be opened. I specifically asked Holland friend to pack the card inside as much as possible so that it looks more voluminous and would cause interest. The letters arrived on the same day.
Answering the second part of your message, I note that in my opinion 1914(or 1917) is getting closer.But this is a completely different topic that will not meet the rules.
In any way, it is very interesting to understand where the letters are still opened. I hope we find out in time.
Best wishes,
Sozont
PS
In a few days, new rules including on interaction with foreigners will come into force. It is not yet clear how they will be applied. Perhaps this is just the start. This is all due to the tightening of military measures. And it seems that they only work on military topics.
But I recently published an article in a British journal and my fellow scientists advised me not to talk about it anywhere, as they are already afraid that I might fall under some suspicion.
Maybe I won't be able to post here anymore. If this happens, then I sincerely thank everyone for the communication, advice, opinions, comments on various topics. I liked participating in zoom meetings. I am honored to be a member of our society.
But let's hope for the best.
Sozont
Hi Sozont,
Hopefully we shall speak again soon, in better times and you can participate again both in our zoom meetings and also this forum.
All the best.
Peter
Hello Sozent
I echo Peter's comments, your contributions both to the Journal and Forum are valuable, Hopefully long may they continue.
Take Care
Chris
Hello Sozont
I am sure we all sympathise with you and are sad that you cannot continue contributing to the forum. I hope others will continue to investigate the 'opening envelope' mystery and report on it here.
Kind regards
Tony Walker