US Naval censor mark tying a British OBE label......

[Nick Colley]

Folks, I've had a copy of what seems to be an unspectacular cover by our member Lynton Wright. See attached. However, once I engaged thinking mode, I was puzzled:

      -  1. the red circular PASSED BY NAVAL CENSOR is a US Navy-style mark, I believe. I'm puzzled because it ties the British examiner label. In the normal sequence of events, I think I'd expect the label to be OVER any unit censor mark. Be that as it may, at present, I'd surmise that it originates from 1942, early on in the deployment of the US Navy on a war footing in the North Atlantic - before their administration had time to catch up and set up such procedures and facilities as their own postal system. How does that sound for a theory? It doesn't address the question of how the US Navy handled the item AFTER the British (civilian) censor. I am at a loss in that respect. We'd appreciate your comments.

      -  2. I Googled Lord Augustus Loftus to see if I could find if he had any formal or structured connection to the US Navy. However, I can find no evidence for a Lord Augustus Loftus alive in the 1940's - but that may well be a function of me not trying hard enough with Google, or asking the right way. It seems the original (?) Lord Augustus died in 1904, and his son in 1924. There appears to have been no children from the son's marriage.

Thanks for any replies you might offer !  :)

Nick Colley and Lynton Wright

[Peter Harvey]

Interesting conundrum,

I also searched hoping to find reference to Lord Augustus Loftus this date, no luck.

The Eaton Square address is interesting, Eaton Square is known to have been used as a undercover address for the Belgium Free Forces in WW2, although the area is residential, the Belgium Embassy was located their 1940 - 1944.

So I am assuming the letter was forwarded. Received by the UK postal censor, label applied and then forwarded (maybe under separate cover) then opened and censored with the U.S Navy cachet.

This theory would suggest a Belgium sailor with the U.S Navy......... far fetched? Need to solve the Lord Augustus Loftus.

[Chris Weddell]

Hi Nick and Peter,

                        I have just looked on Ancestry for a Lord Augustus Loftus. The only Augstus Loftus living in London at this time was born in 1863 and died in 1954 and was in Westminster. I cannot find any others or a Lord by that name. I can check the peerage list's later to see if there was a Lord Loftus at the time.

                                                Chris S-W.

[Chris Weddell]

Peter,

        The Belgium Embassy during World War Two which housed the Exile Belgium Government was based at 105 Eaton Square and not 11. I do not think the cover has anything to do with Belgium but I do have notes for 11 Eaton Square being used by the U.S. Navy which I need to look into.

                                          Chris S-W.

[Frank Schofield]

Nick

Suggest contact Graham Mark, the CCSG may have a record of 6582 in their datebase

Frank Schofield

[Chris Weddell]

Nick,

      Is there a censor number like P.C. 22 on the label. If so could you let me know the number and i can look it up for you maybe.

                                                            Best regards

                                                            Christopher

[Frank Schofield]

Nick

Could this item be from Bermuda?

BERMUDA - USA -  to UK by ship

This could explain the US censor over the tape?

No. 6582 is unlisted by Peter Flynn BUT No. 6571 is

Is the handwriting English?

Frank Schofield

[Nick Colley]

Crikey, chaps, that's a wonderful set of replies - I'm impressed !  :) Apologies for delay in responding- been on vacation, sans laptop.

So, replies, in no particular order:

Frank: good question about the handwriting, I wondered that myself, and decided that I could make no firm conclusion, although I confess it does NOT look like an American hand, does it ? And: yr suggestion re Graham Mark is noted, gd point.

Chris: I suspect it's too late for PC22 ? Probably a PC90, but I can ask Lynton. And: you ARE a tease when you mention you have notes regarding a connection between US Navy and 11 Eaton Square ! Do tell ! The use of the name Lord Augustus Loftus is perplexing, though, eh?

Peter: yes, your comment about a possible Belgian connection, hmm, seems like a low probability, but may connect with my view that the script is not an American hand.......

[Chris Weddell]

Nick,

        I have had 3 covers for the U.S. Navy and 1 for the Army from that address in my notes. It seems to be a lodging address I suspect. I cannot find out anything about the address but when i have 5 minutes i will look it up in the 1921 census.

I still am not sure about Lord Luftus but we do know there was an Augustus Loftus living in Westminster at the time. I am also wondering if this address had anything to do with the U.S. Head Quarters in London? I do have a number of covers to U.S. service personal of WW2 which are addressed to various addresses around this area and this intrigues me as I would not expect this due to where the addresses are.

[Graham Mark]

Hello Nick
Censor 6582 has been recorded by the Civil Censorship Group 3 times all in 1942, operating in London, and handling UK-USA & vv mail. I agree with Peter Harvey's suggestion that the letter could have been censored on its way to Eaton Square from where it was forwarded under cover and later collected a US NAvy marking.
I have looked in Debretts and Burkes but can find no Lord Augustus Loftus.  Loftus was the family name of the Marquis of Ely where the name Augustus does appear.  My editions of these two tomes are of the 1920s but new-born infants get an entry so I wonder if this Lord is a name rather than a title.
We must remember that Duke, Earl and Baron are names for a few of our 'cousins' across the big pond.  I expect there would be more than one Lord to join them.
I hope this helps.
Graham